Syscoin 2018-09-14 Dan AMA

danosphere [3:03 PM]

joined #dantime.

danosphere [3:03 PM]

set the channel purpose: Friday AMAs!

vileda [3:04 PM]

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vileda [3:04 PM]

1st to join, yay.

johnp [3:04 PM]

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vileda [3:04 PM]

How’s things this week Dan?

Tynaghtina [3:05 PM]

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danosphere [3:06 PM]

Things are going, there are some exciting POCs about to start getting developed by the team hackathon-style but we’re still mapping out which concepts we wanna flesh out we’re going to be at a pretty large trade show in November and we want to be able to demonstrate not only BMD and a [cant mention til we PR is to SEDAR] product we have in addition to nascent products in 2-3 other verticals docusign being one of them, the other 2 we still have a constellation of ideas we’re trying to refine down before deciding

Zontar [3:07 PM]

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danosphere [3:07 PM]

web marketplaces aren’t out of the question as being one of those POCs, but further focused development on any one of those POCs is tied into customer interest thesw would be quick and dirty web experience that are full functional in respect to their interaction with the Syscoin protocol and the direct value they would provide to customers in diff industries
and im super proud of the BMD 3.1 release, dev team has done a knockout job of improving that at a rapid pace and BMD 3.2 is even better :sunglasses:

ced [3:09 PM]

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vileda [3:10 PM]

Would be nice for to point to 3.1 rather than 3.0 (edited)
Blockchain Foundry,fl_lossy,h_630,w_1200,f_auto,q_auto/v1/404267/Transparent_500pxl3bydz.png

beardedmage [3:10 PM]

have you guys spoken about OSing the indexer stuff?

alternating [3:10 PM]

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danosphere [3:10 PM]

we have an entirely new and improved website launching in the next week or two, i wanna see it up by Friday but it might take an extra day or two to migrate it from the staging servers
@beardedmage we are actively evaluating that system for an IP, securing that IP if there is any, and then planning to open source it so stay tuned!

sidhujag [3:11 PM]

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beardedmage [3:11 PM]

oh excellent, thanks

beardedmage [3:11 PM]

i need it

johnp [3:11 PM]

What is the latest on the Foundation (edited)

danosphere [3:12 PM]

so on the foundation front we have our group of board members but there are liability concerns for them at a personal level that we need to be cognizant of initially we were going to do this as a Canadian foundation, but we would have to pay for D&O insurance to cover people and that is >100k/yr to do, and has to be renewed every year

mca [3:13 PM]

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danosphere [3:13 PM]

so we are looking at the liability+cost structures of basing the foundation in a different country at this point and we’re still working through the options there but there DO seem to be some feasible paths for us in that respect, just have to talk to more lawyers and accountants to confirm

kicken55 [3:13 PM]

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Tynaghtina [3:13 PM]

dan how would you describe syscoin and BM to the crypto ignorant out there aka 99%of my friend and colleagues

danosphere [3:14 PM]

Syscoin is a protocol that makes it easier to build Dapps that are fast and scale because its DApp features are accessible to standard web devs, no new languages need to be learned

shrill [3:14 PM]

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danosphere [3:14 PM]

for non-techies, I would say Syscoin is a platform that is capable of many things- BM is a demonstration of these capabilities ranging from identity, to certification, marketplaces, assets, and more and what that does is allows for removing middlemen in a number of different industries in respect to those features, and all in a transparent and proveable way

sebastien1234 [3:15 PM]

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danosphere [3:16 PM]

this allows those savings to be passed on to users- be it for cutting out middlemen around digital rights management, identity data silos, or controlling what you can or can’t sell across borders and p2p and through features like escrow you get security in those activities, arbitrated through a mutually trusted party. further more things like ZDAG make SYS particularly suited for POS applications, something many protocols fall down on so when looking at Syscoin in the context of ‘how will this provide real world value or be used by everyday people’ its already got many of the key features in needs at a core level to deliver that value- now its all about enabling experiences that help to demonstrate that more tangibly for everyday users who either dont wanna download a big honking app and wait for it to sync or who don’t understand how to search things from a QT level. We’re pragmatic. We understand that today’s consumers want something easy that they can touch and feel with instant gratification

Gorm [3:20 PM]

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Tynaghtina [3:20 PM]

nicely put thanks, I know we are in the middle of new and exciting things, once everything is stable is there a rough idea how often the basic user would need to update their wallets

saxscrapers [3:21 PM]

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sidhujag [3:21 PM]

in what way?

danosphere [3:21 PM]

@Tynaghtina our goal is to make it so that a normal user almost never has to think about that

syshodlor [3:21 PM]

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Tynaghtina [3:21 PM]

just to make sure they remain on the correct chain and things like that Jag

danosphere [3:21 PM]

we want to enable ‘walletless’ interfaces like Pangolin, a mobile version, and a pure web version that only require a users to enter their credentials to interact w new features and protocol versions

cradox [3:21 PM]

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danosphere [3:22 PM]

we will run servers that WE upgrade to the new version, the aformentioned interfaces simply connect to them, no downloading or chain confusion for normal users

johnp [3:22 PM]

If you wish to stay behave @syshodlor

Tynaghtina [3:22 PM]


J [3:22 PM]

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danosphere [3:22 PM]

similar to what some of the ppl I have been watching chat in #community-dev are doing but specifically run by us, to enable the ease-of-use I was mentioning around those other things we’ll be building

bstr156 [3:22 PM]

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sidhujag [3:23 PM]

yes its a good fit because in general other coins dont have this luxury as people will shout it avoids more full nodes from running but in our case we are incentivizing full nodes through masternodes as well

mac1 [3:23 PM]

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danosphere [3:23 PM]

new version of sys out? no impact to user. They still go to, login w a username and pass that decrypts a locally-encrypted version of their private key, and voila they get all the new goodness with none of the pain or overhead that accompanies Syscoin upgrades today its painless for them because we upgrade our servers the right way and then they just get the benefits of the updates

J [3:24 PM]

@danosphere who is the best singer out of you, Jag, and Schepis? Related, is that person available for ballads on commission? Asking for a friend.

Tynaghtina [3:24 PM]

@danosphere that is the dream

danosphere [3:24 PM]

Oh you know its @lonestar108 hahah
he has incredible rap skills

Tynaghtina [3:24 PM]

thank you for the detailed answers

danosphere [3:24 PM]

@Tynaghtina we are not far off that dream my friend and ideally a web portal would also allow for queried-interactions too so you go to

zippyjetman [3:25 PM]

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danosphere [3:25 PM]

and you get immediately put to a purchase screen where you just confirm the purchase using your local key and then from there you get reverted back to the original site w a callback so the site can show you a receipt and such, similiar to paypal flows
same goes for mobile

syshodlor [3:26 PM]

@danosphere out of the things the team is working on, what are you most excited about in the next months to come?

q [3:27 PM]

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danosphere [3:27 PM]

the things we are doing to enable web-based blockchain products to be used in an easy and seamless way
Pangolin is one of these, but there are other ideas cooking internally too that I don’t want to oversteer on but I think they are good ideas, and may be easier to use for certain ppl than an extension but we are still debating the merits of various approaches- the key there is what theat solution enables and i like what im seeing in #community-dev , we are getting some good ideas to kick around ourselves from the increased activity there #mobilethings and i can understand how indexer-stuff we’ve built would help the community build more things faster, and we want to enable that

blocknugget [3:29 PM]

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beardedmage [3:29 PM]

i think a mobile signing thing would be better in the short term, as long as it can also handle mobile to mobile requests
buts its awesome to hear that indexer stuff is on the path to be community-useable without rewriting
i was griping about that

superdave [3:30 PM]

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syshodlor [3:30 PM]

@danosphere I think a lot of people were pretty hyped for BM Web. Is that still on track for the roadmap or have priorities shifted?

danosphere [3:31 PM]

the near term priority has always been building a way for people to interact with a BMW without a way to authenticate into these types of applications in a secure way BMW is literally worthless and that continues to be the plan today- build solutions that will enable low-friction interaction with WEB based blockchain products BMW is a web based blockchain product
once we have those tools in place BMW or a host of other applications could be built, it really depends on what the landscape looks like when that stuff is ready if people beat us to a web marketplace on SYS we might help enhance that or look to acquire it, rather than reinvent the wheel but we need to have solutions that even make that kind of product feasible for people to use first

James [3:33 PM]

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beardedmage [3:34 PM]

i like the sound of augmenting or acquiring competitors that beat you to market on the web marketplace side (if they beat you) is there a plan to enable native SYS offers to be paid in assets? I asked this in #general but the answer was convoluted
i think @sidhujag said that escrow on the protocol can control an asset but there was something about also using assetallocation send which isn’t part of normal escrow flows and so im still here :confused:

danosphere [3:37 PM]

That is something that I agree we need to enable as it greatly enhances the value and use of SYS assets themselves, im not sure how far off we are on that, not very far i think because that is a major use case for CPS as well they want to run a marketplace that utilizes solely CPS, and assets have ZDAG so there are a lot of good reasons to tie assets directly into the offer/escrow services rather than being tangentially tied to them

blgh [3:38 PM]

Thanks for being here tonight Dan :)! Can you tell us a bit more about the progress on the partnerships with AiBB, Peer Mountain?

Shahn [3:39 PM]

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danosphere [3:40 PM]

So we still plan on leveraging peer mountain for all our KYC needs and we’re still working to understand the api/protocol of their system but even in Pangolin we have ideas around KYC identities so that KYC can be tied into anything that alias signs
from authenticated buyers/sellers on a marketplace to verified identities behind supply chains actors

sidhujag [3:40 PM]

beardedimage you are right.. but assets controlled by addresses will let you do this today.. the flow around it changes but the protocol lets you do it today

danosphere [3:41 PM]

but we haven’t focused on that in depth with them yet, and the press release they put out this week (which i havent read, because i had no idea they were publishing anything) may have been premature we need to get the base authentication applications working before we get into the weeds of how we enable optional KYC around identities created and managed through those solutions but all of this is tied into our long term thinking around how this stuff is useful and used in the real world an alias is great, an alias w MSFT DID based specification behind it using offchain data is even better, and all that + optional KYC is the best then if you sign in to places like Binance, Polo, etc that require KYC you don’t have to repeat the process for each site- that’s the idea you have a blockchain based, KYC’d identity to reference and partners we’re working with hold and provide those documents as needed, reducing repetition and increasing teh value to ppl who use the system

beardedmage [3:43 PM]

thanks @sidhujag I want to really force only offers that accept asset ‘X’ to show in my marketplace and that seems tricky in today’s world

keyare [3:45 PM]

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sidhujag [3:45 PM]

bearededimage that is custom query to the indexer thats all and you have zmq today

beardedmage [3:46 PM]

i need to read the API more :slightlysmilingface: i know how to create an offer priced in an asset

sidhujag [3:46 PM]

you can build out an indexer that just takes those zmqs nad puts them in a table then search that db table

beardedmage [3:46 PM]

but idk how to force all escrownews against it to use that asset

sidhujag [3:47 PM]

well escrownew takes an offer guid and a txid if your not paying in sys..

blgh [3:47 PM]

@danosphere thanks for the detailed answer :). Yes truly valuable. Especially also for sellers willing to sell their products/services on different kind of market places build on syscoin in the future (as reseller channels). Doing KYC in this way for them enables them to easily scale up quickly without the hazzle and complex KYC compliance admin. (edited)

sidhujag [3:47 PM]

so pass the ext txid in and then its really up to the seller to say hey you didnt pay properly

beardedmage [3:47 PM]

is there any plan to enforce that at a protocol level tho?

sidhujag [3:47 PM]

the UI should trap that obviously by checking asset was paid into escrow

beardedmage [3:47 PM]

that sounds like overhead to me if offer guid XYZ only accepts asset FOO why would i need to do more work on top to ensure the escrows are paying in FOO

Zontar [3:48 PM]


johnp [3:48 PM]

Hmm this is dantime :slightlysmilingface:

beardedmage [3:48 PM]

escrow new takes an offer GUID

iv_sek [3:48 PM]

joined #dantime.

johnp [3:48 PM]

Keep it on topic please

danosphere [3:48 PM]

ha sorry i dont have those answers :slightlysmilingface:

sidhujag [3:48 PM]

the only accepts is just a tag.. its not enforced
its enforced at a app layer not proto layer

beardedmage [3:49 PM]

ill take it to #community-dev sry, interested in hearing more later tho @sidhujag
we can keep this focused to the topic at hand, sorry!

bstr156 [3:51 PM]

All in all, I now realize more than ever, I need more SYS.

blgh [3:54 PM]

@danosphere Regarding Pangolin (and revenue streams), nowadays perhaps still few people use crypto to pay (because of volatility). How you guys expect Pangolin to be used by consumers/businesses with crypto on the short term/nowadays?

Or will it be enabled as well for FIAT payments on the short term (with lower fees than traditional payment providers) and you expect later people to switch more towards crypto (en mass)? Curious about that :). (edited)

peekay [3:55 PM]

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danosphere [3:55 PM]

@blgh so a lil of both tbh
we are working to enable fiat to SYS/crypto directly from Pangolin- so thats for the few ppl who use it to pay
and then Pangolin (or, more broadly the authentication functionality it provides) is going to be needed for people to interact with b2b web blockchain products as a whole anyway
so i see it being used in both cases

messycaptain [3:56 PM]

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danosphere [3:56 PM]

but in the latter its a requirement, in the former (pay for things) its more of an option

Bill Perkins [3:56 PM]

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danosphere [3:56 PM]

but an option we want to encourage and reduce friction around even going the other way like say most ppl dont pay w crypto right, but there are all these ppl that have SYS and wanna use it where only USD is accepted. we want to enable that kinda stuff through Pangolin as well- where you say ‘Pay with Syscoin’ for something priced in USD on ebay what happens then is, through Pangolin, we convert your SYS to USD, load the USD on a virtual credit card, and then use that credit card to pay the ebay merchant in USD and you can always buy more SYS through Pangolin as well, using USD (or other fiat) – that’s the goal

messycaptain [3:59 PM]

@Dan…….. Whilst every coin was bottoming out why did someone from the team come out and said BM was shelved and being handed over to the community
And causing major syscoin stock hodlers investors
Zero or little confidence

Mass confusion amongst all those other groups telegram channels etc etc
The price went down as an obvious result of this predetermined action

The price is hardly recovering because of fear, uncertainty and doubt

danosphere [3:59 PM]

this was not a predetermined action in any way, these questions in the AMA aren’t scripted
I’m focused on the long term value of the protocol and products on top of it, im not watching price as I provide people answers related to what we’re prioritizing

vileda [4:00 PM]

No cause and effect proven there either, unless it tanked ETH too

danosphere [4:00 PM]

and 99% of other alts…
other than DOGE I guess… cause who knows

Pruane [4:02 PM]

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danosphere [4:02 PM]

I gotta hope off here in 9min just a heads up if there are any remaining burning questions :slightlysmilingface:

blocknugget [4:02 PM]

In your opinion/s, what will be the first application of syscoin to truly add value to the coin?

danosphere [4:02 PM]

i honestly think creating a b2b application that a validating customer utilizes will be massive for Syscoin
some others were trying to tie SYS value to number of transactions, i think thats misleading

vileda [4:03 PM]

@danosphere any update on a timeline for a roadmap.?
Just asking before someone else brings it up after

danosphere [4:03 PM]

i think SYS value is in the use cases it can faciliate, if major companies start using it for X that will provide more value than any kinda of transactional volume ever will
because it will increase awareness while also forcing them to use the token day to day in order to get business done, it will be the kinda of thing you see on news channels all over the place like IBMs accomplishments
and i think that acts as a catalyst for more people and business to look at this ‘Syscoin’ thing and we can move into adjacent or other products from there

blgh [4:04 PM]

Aight, got it :). Looking to English Forward and the partnership; how the business case should look like more or less. Their platform is being build on Syscoin like a language marketplace where teachers are connected to students and payed with SYS (resulting in transactions on the Syscoin network)?

danosphere [4:05 PM]

syscoin fees are super low, transactional volume isnt going to make masternodes tons more value; real world use and awareness will
yep @blgh i think they are leaning towards an asset, which again even devoid of millions of transactions creates a huge amount of awareness where before there was none
they are an established company using an asset on the Syscoin protocol to reward and incentivize users, to me that does a lot of value for SYS

mcshawrick [4:06 PM]

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danosphere [4:06 PM]

because you get these companies to use this stuff, they market their own platform which uses it, and by relation SYS gets a ton of exposure
and that is a very repeatable model
its not just a bunch of ICOs with empty promises that may never deliver, its companies using this stuff as a core part of their business

beardedmage [4:09 PM]

that sort of use is exactly where my questions around forced-asset use stem from, total :thumbsup:

rarkm [4:10 PM]

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danosphere [4:11 PM]

and just to be clear @blgh yes it will result in those tx on Syscoin, but i dont think thats the bigger part of the value there

peekay [4:11 PM]

Are you guys going to the hamburg hackathon?

danosphere [4:11 PM]

i think the bigger part of the value is the company being bound to using Syscoin, marketing its asset on top of Syscoin, and in turn the ‘additional business eyeballs’ that brings the platform as a whole
We aren’t planning to at the moment @peekay but I’ll check it out now that you stuck it on my radar (edited)

peekay [4:12 PM]

Nice. Good to know.

danosphere [4:12 PM]

do you have a link btw?

vitacastro [4:12 PM]

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blgh [4:12 PM]

@danosphere yeah to me too, massive and also a really cool usecase! Good way of marketing as well. Would be good to highlight this also on the new site. BMW is cool off course, but what we need to still make more clear to people (as community and team) is that in fact, Syscoin is a platform where 50 BMWs can be build on. Vertical market places are an ever rising trend (data, certificates, energy, language courses, you name it).. Imo Syscoin atm has the best cards to enable the potential of blockchain for (decentralise) market places of all kinds of purposes.

danosphere [4:14 PM]

10000% agree @blgh – there are a crazy number of different verticals BMWs could target; Fiverr, Upwork, Uber, Airbnb, Ebay, Amazon, Paxful, GiftcardGranny the list goes on
but people need to realize thats how all this works, its not one uber portal necessarily, there is a large amount of value in these niche marketplaces that provide direct value vs a centralized competitor in a very focused way

peekay [4:14 PM]

I’ll get it from my work. Hang on

danosphere [4:15 PM]

I actually really like the Airbnb idea, i think thats RIPE for disruption ever since airbnb started working with govts
thanks @peekay (edited)

Sergej86 [4:15 PM]

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danosphere [4:16 PM]

And the airbnb path has interesting revenue opportunities too, since its literally not possible on other platforms in many locales
like i know in Vancouver airbnb is a huge nightmare now cause you need a business license, building owner approval, and airbnb checks all that
put your place on on decentralized airbnb and all those obstacles fade away and you can still get away charging a middleman fee
cause there is no other option for that market
and i expect that govt <-> airbnb coop to expand to other locales in short order

blgh [4:17 PM]

Exactly, don’t forget also online market places for food :). Rising trend in China, +60% searches their grocceries already online over there.. trend which is ‘confirmed’ by Amazon acquiring Wholefoods and moving into that e-comm vertical as well.. lots of interesting stuff going on!

danosphere [4:17 PM]

oh dont get me started on Wholefoods lol

gbeast [4:17 PM]

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danosphere [4:18 PM]

I have a whole vision for improved supply chain and transparency using SYS for them that gives concious consumers 100% more transparency around those animal welfare ratings they tout so proudly and opaquely in all their stores
already have our sales guy working to get in their ear so we can pitch em
pretty simple idea –
Whole Foods Market
5-Step® Animal Welfare Rating
Look for the ratings on our fresh beef, chicken and pork. It’s your way of knowing how the animals were raised for the meat you are buying.
May 13th, 2013
“prove it”
but again, they need a way to interact w these systems seamlessly- mobile, web, desktop; that is what we’re focused on in the very near term

lokalp [4:19 PM]

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danosphere [4:20 PM]

My apologies to anyone who just joined but I do need to step away here- last questions anyone?

blgh [4:20 PM]

Aight, yes so much to winn in these areas..! Of course, that makes sense.. building blocks and tech need to be in place, instead of selling baked air!
Thanks for your time Dan! :+1::skin-tone-2:

danosphere [4:21 PM]

and i dont need to go into how ‘Wholefoods uses Syscoin for supply chain transparency’ would add value to SYS to I? 😉

blgh [4:21 PM]


danosphere [4:21 PM]

and how that would also likely force other major players to adopt a similar system or be left behind (Trader Joes, Harris Teeter, etc)
i mean im imaging QR codes next to the product your about to buy, that takes you to a third party website referencing blockchain data to tell you where that food has been

blgh [4:22 PM]

We can then shift to another galaxy I am afraid! :joy:

danosphere [4:22 PM]

literally from farm, to processor, to wholesaler, to the store you’re standing in
and at each step along the way you get detailed info about those different people touching your food

danosphere [4:23 PM]

same concepts apply to other industries as well; its stuff that gets me really excited and im sure once the community see some of this play our IRL they’ll be just as excited :slightlysmilingface:

jg [4:23 PM]

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blgh [4:24 PM]

Yes, think so too :).

danosphere [4:24 PM]

I gotta hop off for now but appreciate everyone stopping by to ask questions and hopefully I provided some further clarity on our bigger vision for how this tech becomes even more valuable through real world use
hope everyone has a great weekend! looking forward to seeing everyone back here next week, we’ll keep using this room I like how it keeps the discussion focused :thumbsup: have a great weekend all!

beardedmage [4:25 PM]

thanks @danosphere!

online123 [4:26 PM]

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locutus [4:28 PM]

Who left the light on?

johnp [4:28 PM]

The miner

keyare [4:29 PM]

lol nice one

blgh [4:30 PM]

Thanks Dan! :ok_hand::skin-tone-2:

Sandy [4:36 PM]

joined #dantime along with 43 others.

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